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searsportshuffle

Line to leader connection

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Kind of a small survey.

I am wondering what methods you guys use to attach your leader to your fly line and what you feel are the advantages of that method.

I have tried a bunch but have always gone back to the nail knot because it seems to go through the guides well and is small.

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3 in. piece of 25# to 50# mono. Nail knot to line, perfection loop at end. Enables quick loop to loop leader changes. Have had problem (severe cracking and weakening of fly line) when using a whipped loop at leader end of fly line.

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Whitlock super-glue splice. Totally seamless....cannot catch the tip-top. Slick as snot.

I used the Lefty Kreh-designed whipped loop system for years...and often had to re-pull the caught loop out of the tip-top.

Because I favor knotted leaders over the knotless the system was designed for I have to take a razor blade and shave away part of the .021 leader butt to get it through the eye of the needle...but if that's too much of a pain just buy one extruded leader with a butt diameter of .021 and cut it at about the 3 foot mark.

Dave M

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I use two methods. The first, and preferred, is to make a loop of fly line and whip it in place with microbraid. Some people use tying tread. Perfection loop on the leader, or shorb loop on my furled leader, and you have a loop to loop connection.

The second I use is what Peter D described - nail not a piece of heavy mono to the fly line and put a perfection loop in it.

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PS- Super glue knots then cover with thin coat of Loon's UV KNOT SENSE. See alsao Blanton's site for adding braided loop to fly line.

http://www.danblanton.com/gettinglooped.html

and for Dave M's approach (also a good one):

http://flyfisherman.com/skills/dwnoknot/index1.html

Can splice a piece of mono to line and add perfection loop if rapid leader changes necessary. There is a rigid holding/supporting " split vice" available to support flyline while inserting needle and running mono into fly line core for splice. Some can hold butt of fly line (as in attached sketch)while inserting needle into line core.

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I use the Whitlock Blind-loop splice on my plastic lines. On my silk since they don't have a core I insert a shorb loop on a furled section ala the Whitlock blind splice. All loop-loop on both ends as I like DT lines so I can change when needed.

Ron

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Preferred: Needle nail knot...then UV Knot Sense to smooth...

What might actually be on there: just about anything.... including a sheet bend of fly line onto a perfection looped leader...a fisherman's knot of straight leader material tied directly to a braided loop just as if it were a hook eye...

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I too use a true needle knot (I use the Shimazaki Leader Splicer Kit available from Feather Craft). I superglue a 4-6 inch piece of 1X mono into the line and then tie a perfection loop in the end of the mono. At that point I'm ready to add a furled leader for dryflie fishing or straight tippet for nymphing. I redo each of my lines every spring and the mono lasts the entire year typically.

Leader Splice Kit.

3151006288_b52460d9f6_o.jpg

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hmm I must be doing something wrong. I just have a 7.5 foot 4x leader with a loop at the butt end, I just do a loop to loop (handshake) connection for the leader. Then a fly at the end of that. When I end up clipping off too much leader after many fly changes, I do a surgical knot to connect a piece of tippet to the cut-down leader. Am I doing anything wrong by this?

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Originally posted by tkearins

hmm I must be doing something wrong. I just have a 7.5 foot 4x leader with a loop at the butt end, I just do a loop to loop (handshake) connection for the leader. Then a fly at the end of that. When I end up clipping off too much leader after many fly changes, I do a surgical knot to connect a piece of tippet to the cut-down leader. Am I doing anything wrong by this?

I'm not sure "wrong" is the correct term here.

A 7.5' leader is *very* short, IMO, for just about anything but streamer fishing.

My leaders, FWIW, are (usually):

Dry Line (4 or 5 wt rod)12 to 16'...a maximum in high water of 4X...usually 5X or 6X.

Nymphing: 6' out to the indicator...right angle of 5X flouro off that (4 or 5')

Streamers: Sink Tip line : 3' of 0X

Salt: (Stripers) 6' (3 ft of 40 lb.....2 ft of 25 lb.....1 ft of 15 lb.)

I suspect if you lengthened your leaders a bit you might be better off, but, as always, on these Boards opinions will vary....you can rest assurred of that........

Dave M

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Tim, you're certainly not doing anything wrong. It sounds like you have a fly line with a built-in loop (Orvis??) that allows you to attached a leader with its own loop. Very typical for your situation.

However should you buy another line, one without a built-in loop, some alternative method would be needed to affix your leader. It is those alternative methods we're talking about here.

For my part I don't own a single line with a loop end so I need a way to get a loop attached. I install a 4-6in. piece of mono and then add leaders and tippet from there. Others here attach a complete leader to their lines.

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Originally posted by dryflie

For my part I don't own a single line with a loop end so I need a way to get a loop attached.

Like Al...I don't own a single flyline with the loop attached either; but the last dozen (at least) I've bought had the loop built in. The first thing I do with a new flyline is take the clippers and cut off those %$#&(&% loops. I abhor the damned things.(I also cut off the last 15 feet of the new 105 foot flylines, too. I like long casting as much as the next guy.....but I seldom ;) have the need to cast 105'...plus 15' of leader, for a 120' cast. The only guys making 120' casts are either casting pros; or Internet Guru's. ;)

Now...truth-be-told...many of my Buddies think I'm nuts for buying Rio or Orvis SS leader kits and building my own leaders. It's really easy to just loop/loop on a new factory leader......but I'm stubborn as hell......and anally retentive..when it comes to the performance of my leaders.

I do have the pin vise to atach them that Peter showed above; but use the Shimizake Leader Tool that Al showed above. That thing is slick-as-snot.

Dave M

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Tim

I have both looped lines and non-looped lines and do not have a problem using either. I would agree that generally I use a longer leader and tippet arraingment and find it works better. When not using the loop I prefer nail or nailess nail nots and then I use bloodnots to replace the tippets. If you ad things like super glue and epoxys and other treatements then you will get a slicker and smoother not with less chance of hangup in the rod.

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I use a duncun loop. This may be the same thing as a nail-less nail knot?...not really sure.

MarcP

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It is the nail knot without the nail. I have tied it many times stream side for friends who have had issues with gear and wanting to get back on the water quickly

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another question.....if using a fairly heavy stonefly nymph (size 10 or 8), with a 5 weight rod and 5 weight line, I've been using 4x leader to the fly, with 4x tippet after that to the dropper egg. Is 4x too thick for this? I don't want to spook trout with thick mono if I don't have to.

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Originally posted by tkearins

another question.....if using a fairly heavy stonefly nymph (size 10 or 8), with a 5 weight rod and 5 weight line, I've been using 4x leader to the fly, with 4x tippet after that to the dropper egg. Is 4x too thick for this? I don't want to spook trout with thick mono if I don't have to.

Usually drop one size tippet between the dropper and point fly. If I'm using a 4x, I actually drop to a 6x tippet between the two.

The general overall rule of thumb for tippet size is to divide the fly size by three, size 12 fly = size 4x tippet. But that does not really apply to nymphing or streamers, it is more for dry flies. 4x is good for nymphing, 5x works well too. I start with 4x or 5x, and drop sizes if I'm getting snubbed by the fish. Flouro is also a good option if the fish are being finicky.

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another question.....if using a fairly heavy stonefly nymph (size 10 or 8), with a 5 weight rod and 5 weight line, I've been using 4x leader to the fly, with 4x tippet after that to the dropper egg. Is 4x too thick for this? I don't want to spook trout with thick mono if I don't have to.

If I was fishing an 8-10 size Stonefly I'd fish it on 3X just to make the casting easier. Mono underwater isn't going to spook anything.

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